Jason Donaldson

I have three loosely related questions:

1) I have benefited greatly from CPAP for some time now. That said, I have been curious whether a dental appliance was worth trying, to have a backup in situations of no power for the CPAP - air travel, outage, disaster, etc. At a recent routine dental visit, I asked my dentist about this, and was shocked at the level of cost this entails (c. $2,500) If anyone has experience with such an appliance, I'm interested, in case of unexpected insurance coverage that makes it worth trying.

2) That said, the conversation also involved him recommending that I consider a mouthguard for lifting. While a dentist-supplied one is also pretty steep (though he'd "throw it in" if I did the sleep apnea one...), I see cheap OTC versions. I understand that some lifters use them, and at $25 or so, it might be worth considering, especially if anyone has experience that can speak to this use case.

3) Here's the interesting part, though... In the conversation with the dentist, I asked offhand about light-headedness or passing out under load. He enthusiastically suggested that the benefits of a mouthguard during lifting can help with alignment and whatnot to reduce pressure on the blood supply to the brain, reducing this risk. I understand he has bills to pay, of course, and that his worldview is decidedly xenocentric by nature, but I am curious about this from the standpoint of knowledge in the lifting domain.

I manage my head rushes just fine on the primary lifts, especially the press. I have had a couple of instances on the pin press, however, where I've lost consciousness, thankfully without injury. I have never experienced this when grinding unsuccessfully and missing a regular press - only when pressing from the pins. One was an isolated incident about five years ago, where I figured out how to deal with it and was fine from then on, continuing to train the lift. However, the other one and a half times (once waking up on the deck, once a "standing eight count" situation) were very recent, and so I've cut out pin pressing altogether.

I don't hold my Valsalva in my mouth - I bare my teeth to prevent that - and I don't relax all of a sudden after the lift, making sure to keep my grip and my legs clenched to work against a sudden drop in BP. In fact, the full passing out on this recent pair of incidents came before I'd completed the lift, as verified by an observer.

My suspicion on the whole effect is therefore that it's related to pressure from the musculature around the arteries of the neck that's basically choking me out, and that biting a mouthguard isn't likely to affect this one way or another, but I don't want to lean on my own understanding if I can help it. I also want to make sure I'm not missing something else. The press is my favorite lift, after all.

Maybach

The blue book discusses lightheadedness on the press, and as you say, is generally thought to be due to increased pressure on the carotid sinus, which can provoke a baroreflex action at the heart which causes a rapid drop in blood pressure (similar to a "sleeper hold"). The solution given is to take a new breath between each rep (and therefore reduce the exposure of the sinus to high pressure). I have had...mixed success with this technique. The times I get lightheaded on the press seem to be due to the actual muscle contraction in the area (since it appears to be randomly and uniformly distributed among "heavy" reps, such as first reps or singles, rather than merely later or especially effortful reps). This would seem to jibe with your experience of it on the pin press more than the full press. And the loss of "tightness" required to take a breath can in some cases cost at least a full rep. It is perhaps a matter of insufficient skill on my part in taking a shallow enough breath to alleviate pressure but not to lose tightness, but that's as may be.

It is possible, I suppose, that a "heady" Valsalva could increase pressure on the carotid sinus sufficient to provoke this action, and if so, a mouth guard could alleviate this. Then again, a well executed "heady" Valsalva at the right time can also work to alleviate this faintness if it's not too severe.

Mark Rippetoe

My advice is to take an open-mouthed valsalva. Works for me.

Adriano Alves

Anyone have experience with heavy sandbag training (since they are loadable) after depleting all NLP (which is not my case) in a way that does not compromise strength training at all? They worth it? Or is it just a waste of time and sweat?

Southern Lifter

How old are you and what are your numbers?

15-20 minutes of intensive sandbag should not disturb your strength process. It is also a good exercise (if you know how to boxing, Lol)

Adriano Alves

Oh man sorry

The sandbag i was saying is a heavy sandbag full of sand for lifting and toss

I have no plans to do any other stressful exercise (with excession the prowler of course) until I really finish my NLP.

Sandbag lifting is something I really like, but I have no reason to do it if there's no benefits or if I mess with the strength training. That's why I am asking.

32 years old
Height: 1,83
Weight: 125kg
Squat 3x5 - 190kg
Press 3x5 - 85kg
Bench 3x5 - 116kg
Deadlift 1x5 - 185kg (working on my form)

Nick Delgadillo

There's no way you can load a sandbag heavy enough, and in a way that you can lift it to drive any appreciable strength adaptation. This is regardless of what the functional movement people think regarding loading multiple planes of motion. The limiting factor with a sandbag very quickly becomes being able to interact with it.

A 200 lb sandbag is heavy and hard to deal with, but it's little more than a conditioning tool - an ineffective one at that - because you only adapt up to the point at which the bag produces stress. As Johnsonville and I and many others have experienced. A 180 lb human being who is fighting back is a much harder conditioning problem than a sandbag that's 215, or 220, or maybe even 250 lbs.

So if you're strength training, a sandbag has no value other than playing construction laborer. If you're not strength training, it also has no value because you'll get more results in any measurable domain using a barbell.